Rating and Judging

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Permalink Reply by Steve Nally on November 18, 2009 at 2:20pm

Just as I suspected...

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Permalink Reply by Brian Thiel on November 25, 2009 at 6:28pm

Very interesting article. Thanks for the post. I now appreciate why Boston Beer Co enter so many comps world wide, easy to pick up medals...even a blind squirrel can find a nut...sometimes they even have a good beer or two. It is truly a subjective process. I have experienced the same gold best in class one year and thought with all the hard work even better the following year and nothing. Thought provoking!!

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Permalink Reply by Stu McKinlay on November 25, 2009 at 8:09pm

It's an eye opener isn't it? I'm surprised that there's been so few comments...

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Permalink Reply by 666 Brewing on November 25, 2009 at 8:13pm

Ahhh...but those are wine judges ;-)

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Permalink Reply by Stu McKinlay on November 25, 2009 at 8:25pm

who've often gone through a very rigorous (and expensive) program to become accredited!

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Permalink Reply by 666 Brewing on November 25, 2009 at 8:51pm

but that could be the problem...nothing beats experience in my opinion, I doubt alot of wine judges have ever made a wine!

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Permalink Reply by Stu McKinlay on November 25, 2009 at 9:13pm

or you could look at it that making beer and judging beer are completely seperate tasks.

ask a scientist involved in the manufacture of perfume esters, or turning fish by-product into make-up compounds, how many perfume makers, make-up manufacturers or fisherman they have in their sensory panels. I'd guess their are none.


ps. I know a few beer judges who have made wine!

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Permalink Reply by 666 Brewing on November 25, 2009 at 9:46pm

they are separate tasks....but isnt feedback from judging important as well? And I suspect a person who hasnt had hands on experience in the process would not be able to give that. I would rather have my beer judged by an experienced brewer over a qualified judge any day....although both would be a bonus!

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Permalink Reply by Soren on November 25, 2009 at 11:07pm

I don't think its all that suprising that the scores can swing a few point either way, a 5 % margin of error is nothing statistically speaking. In wine I don't find it surprising that some judges pick certain aroma and flavours while others pick something different, after all many of these are quite subtle and often hiding behind (or playing a part in) the bigger picture... It will be highly subjective and dependent on serving temps etc.
Likewise, the perception of sweetness and colour: although you don't taste with your eyes, you still get the first impression through these and that counts, unless you are a robot.
What is more disturbing is the story about the same wine under 3 diferent labels winning 1 double gold and 2 drainpours, and how it seems the medals are awarded more or less at random, but even that may not be so suprising:
I think the wine industry has reached a point where all the good wines are pretty equal and therefore the results are going to look rather random. There are so many talented wine makers and growers and there has been so much research that there is not much variation left. Craft beer has a long way to go before it gets there, although the trend is forming in the states. I bet in a few years we'll see the same patern of "randomness" among the elite breweries, simply because they will all be very good and therefore it comes down to the subjective decision of the judge, which hopefully will appear rather random, otherwise we might as well just invent a machine to tell us whether a beer is good or not...

Dunno if that makes any sense to any one but me:)

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Permalink Reply by JoKing on November 26, 2009 at 6:26am

Craft beer has a long way to go before it gets there

I'm not sure that it is even possible - but at least when it's good... it's really good: and it is even more enjoyable for it.

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Permalink Reply by Tony on November 26, 2009 at 8:50am

I have often argued that tasting and judging (whether it be wine, beer or whatever), is a totally subjective exercise. I have often thought that so called judges or gurus, had their heads up the arse and were no more qualified than you or I. And this article supports that view. I know that some say they can discern certain characteristics and flavours, maybe so? But who cares? I mean, what does that mean? It doesn't tell you whether it is better or worse for it, it just means it 'may' have that characteristic. At the end of the day, one mans pilsner is another mans piss.

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